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December 27, 2009
by Davey Wavey
129 Comments



The hierarchy of gays: Who’s on ‘top’?

Bottoms of the world, I salute you. Least we forget that there are no tops without bottoms, I’m always puzzled by the stigma against those who ‘take it’. There is a self-created hierarchy of gaydom. Tops are at the top, and well… bottoms are at the bottom.

If you’re straight, you’re probably already confused. Gay Sex 101: Tops are guys that do the f*****g. Bottoms are guys that get f****d. Of course, things aren’t always so cut and try. Many people enjoy a little of both, and fall anywhere between the spectrum. And a whole bunch of guys would feel entirely uncomfortable identifying with a sexual position.

“You’re such a bottom,” is a common insult amongst gay men. I’m guilty of saying it from time to time, and I have certainly been on the receiving end of more than a few bottom jokes. After-all, I drive a Mini Cooper – which my friends call the bottomobile.

It all begs the question: “What is wrong with being a bottom?”

I suspect that our bottom-phobia stems from our own insecurities and internalized homophobia. Tops are often considered more masculine. On the flip side, there is a generalized correlation between femininity and bottoming. Masculinity is usually considered to be a desirable characteristic in gay men. That’s a lot of generalizing but the implication is that tops are more masculine and thus higher on the hierarchy.

Go on manhunt, craigslist, dudesnude or any other gay hookup site. Take out a paper and pen and make two columns. In one column, make a check mark for each profile that says, “masculine guys only.” In the other column, “feminine guys only.” One of your columns is going to be very empty; the other – very full.

There’s blood on my hands, too. I’m guilty of idolizing (maybe even worshiping) masculine men – gay or straight. In just a few hours, I’ll be watching Tom Brady quarterbacking for the Patriots with mind full of dirty thoughts. For me, Tom’s oozing masculinity is the biggest turn on.

I don’t need to tell you that I’m not the most masculine guy that ever walked the planet. I may be muscular, but I couldn’t catch a football, spit or pick my crotch if my life depended on it. I often suspect that I’m looking for the masculinity in other guys that I crave in myself. Or, perhaps, because I’m insecure with my own femininity, I’m repelled by it in other guys. I may not be alone in this boat.

At any rate, this isn’t a puzzle that I can solve in a blog post (or even perhaps in an entire lifetime). However, I think bringing awareness to the issue is important. When we express our disgust of feminine guys, or belittle those who bottom (or perhaps even assume a connection between the two), I think we speak very loudly about an underlying issue within us. Awareness helps shed a sliver of light on this very dark and painful part of our gay psyche.

In the meantime, I give a lot of credit to guys who openly, willingly and proudly identify as bottoms in a culture that doesn’t always return the love. A tip of the hat to you.

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129 Comments

  1. This subject sure has generated many responses — all interesting ! There IS much “bottom stigma” out there. My views:

    — yes, the stigma comes from equating “getting f****d” to “being the woman”. That is a simple reflection of Women’s struggle to rise from being degraded and treated as 2nd class for thousands of years to equal treatment.

    — Many gay guys just aren’t interested in ButtSex and may never go there in their entire life. I don’t know the percentage, but I’d bet it’s higher than one might imagine.

    — There are many happy couples that are “2 tops” or “2 bottoms”. After all, sex isn’t the “end-all be-all” of a relationship.

    — Some of the best bottoms I’ve been with are VERY good tops …and vice-versa :-)

    — Sometimes I bottom out of selfishness. I top when I feel generous towards a guy.

    — “Pushy Bottoms” ? ~~~ not a fan of ‘em !

  2. Hugo, i think all guys should experience “frottage” atleast once in their life! Anyone here can google: heroic homosex, for all-info, etc. But i’m versatile, and see nothing-wrong with anal-sex although i prefer frottage(cock2cock) and oral-sex, when i’m-not being-bi. And Davey, yet-anothah “Great-post,” and i wanna wish a “Happy New-Yeah” to you, Hugh, Davey and All the-rest-of the blog and “Beta Chat-Room” buddies! :-) – - – davvi

  3. Hugo, i think all guys should experience “frottage” atleast once in their life! Anyone here can google: heroic homosex, for all-info, etc. But i’m versatile, and see nothing-wrong with anal-sex although i prefer frottage(cock2cock) and oral-sex, when i’m-not being-bi. And Davey, yet-anothah “Great-post,” and i wanna wish a “Happy New-Yeah” to you, Hugo, Davey and All the-rest-of the blog and “Beta Chat-Room” buddies! :-) – - – davvi Ooopz, i meant, Hugo. “my-bad.”

  4. True, true.

    Personally, I am versatile and I prefer a versatile boyfriend because I get tired of doing the same thing over and over. Sometimes I feel like a horny sex slave and sometimes the sight of a hot ass makes me wanna f**k it up the wall all night long.

    My thoughts have always been that if a guy is 100% bottom, then he wants to have a vagina. And If he is 100% top, then he wants to be straight. Kinda black and white thinking, but it’s just how I feel. I think people should be open to any expression of sexuality.

  5. Before I came out, one of the most attractive aspects of the prospects of gay sex to me was the balance that it implied: two people uniting as equals – both male, sharing the intimacy. The guy I came out with told me how amazing it felt to be with someone where there was such mutuality. As I met other people, though, I was amazed at how many gay men were focussed on role playing (top/bottom; butch/fem; male/female). I was so disappointed, because I thought the ideal had been missed. I enjoyed both activities, but preferred being entered. Sincd the dominant culture seemed to be hierarchical,the dilemma was always how to communicate that you’d like to partner with someone, yet not feel that you were thereby placing yourself in a secondary position. I eventually gave up, and have lived a chaste life for a long time.

    • thank you Doug that was the point I wanted to get across. I only have a PS3 right now so it takes forever to write anything.

  6. A tip of the hat to you David daring to write a post about such a delicate subject and so personnal. What do I think of ? It’s good to be the king!

  7. Okay this is my whole thing about it. Whether you’re a bottom or a top, either way you are still gay. If you are engaging in sexual acts with another man you are Gay or bisexual(in most cases). Being the “bottom” doesn’t make you any more gay than being the “top”. The fact is I know some pretty masculine guys who would bottom just as soon as they would top. The thing is people need to get over this stigma and be happy with who they are instead of using titles, to make excuses for themselves.

    Just something we should all think about :)

    Sing, live, and Love.

    Jaybo

  8. Top, bottom, versitle, feminine, masculine, androgynous, ect. Does it really f*****g matter?! NO! These are just superficial labels that have absolutely nothing to do with who a person is at the core of thier being (heart & soul). Labels will never do anything but divide us as a community. Live for love & love will live for you.

  9. Davey the only car more bottoming would be a vw beetle / converible over the mini cooper LOL, Nick

  10. I am CONSTANTLY amazed that people will do one thing, nor the other…. but absolutely7 REFUSE to do what they actually are asking someone else TO do.

    ie – they will only top, but tey want you to only bottom….

    c’mon guys, WE ALL have the same equipment…we all have holes, and we all have poles… it’s silly not to use them all…. :)

  11. i’m bottom and proud of it, i love the feeling :)

  12. I have a group of bottom friends and we definitely own bottom-hood.. when we go out.. we search for tops and we laugh at our bottom personalities while searching… we love it. we call each other bottom and we make light of it… my friends and I are great. we own it and we love to find our masculine tops :)

  13. I have a group of bottom friends and we definitely own our bottom-hood.. when we go out we search for tops and we laugh at our bottom personalities while searching… we love it. we call each other bottom and we make light of it… my friends and I are great. we own it and we love to find our masculine tops :)

  14. I agree that labeling is nessary to a certain extent. I.e., I am a bottom looking for a top. What I was talking about is people who let thier entire identity revolve around thier sexuality & what position they take during f*****g. There is so much more to who we are than who we f**k and what position we assume during the f*****g.

  15. I think being a bottom is perfectly fine; I also think being pressed down and f****d the hell out is totally hot. I haven’t experienced the whole bottom discrimination thing, so I don’t know how to address that issue…
    I’m sorry to say this, but being a bottom I do like guys treating me like woman in bed. ;)
    (I’m sorry because I’m basically supporting stereotypes)

    • Enjoy it and be damned.
      WHY are you listening to dreary puritanical politicos and feminists.
      They love being miserable and feeling guilty about enjoying life.
      Take away guilt and they are so unhappy.
      They’re far worse than any religious group.
      Just retain some self respect in it all.
      And don’t go gettings so ecited taht you put yourself at risk.
      … or so excited that you behave badly by enticing people who are already in a committed relationship away from their partners.
      The problem is finding someone you can trust and letting them know your love of being dominated is a choice you can change.
      Have fun.

    • Listen to yourself, “Enjoy it and be damned.” Why should I listen to you anyway, you don’t sound much of a supporter for free wealth and equality either…
      It’s MY choice and for MY own amusement to be that way, where did the feminists and politicos even came from?
      I said “sorry” for the fact that I’m a very stereotipical gay bottom, so I was trying to avoid people like you. Even after I said sorry you still get offended, that doesn’t sound too open minded to me. What make you so different from those close-minded “dreary puritanical politicos and feminists”?
      I’m not trying to argue (maybe just a little…), I just want you to know that it’s MY own choice that I’m not going to change, it has nothing to do with anybody else.

    • Blimey you are to8uchy.
      Why shouldn’t you enjoy being treated like a woman?
      Why shouldn’t women who identify that way prefer to be referred to as “ladies”.
      Yet certain dreary ultra feminists used to get nasty if I as a man refered too such
      women as ladies.
      Free wealth – have you ever lived in a commune?
      It gets interesting when people who have nothing and conside rit their right to share things you have worked hard for without showing any respect.
      Enjoy being passive even subservient, why not, i do.
      But sadly in life we always have to learn to satnd up for ourselves.
      That is what you have just done.
      Well done.
      Be happy. x

    • Sorry I can’t really understand your point besides the last 5 lines, maybe the spelling and the grammar…?
      Anyway, thanks for that last 5 lines, I don’t understand how is standing up for ourselves “sadly” though.

    • Thanks for concerning about my risk though;)
      that’s actually one of my biggest worries…

  16. After reading half of the replies, I don’t understand… I’m bottome because I like it better, I love to be f****d, and tops look at us as we’re being generous? I find that offensive, even as a compliment. It’s not like we’re giving up something or doing something we don’t like. How is that generous? We’re just doing exactly what we like and stick our butt out for the exact same reason tops stick their dicks out!

  17. I plead the 5th

  18. I’m a HOMOSEXUAL. Which means I am a male; attracted to males. What attracts me to someone initially has nothing to do with how I appraise his masculinity or femininity. Labels are boring, tired, and constricting. Just enjoy the company of others…free from bottom, top, masculine, feminine categories. We all are unique, wonderful people. To limit your scope is to limit yourself.

  19. Davey… some suggest that males do not have the same pain threshold as females. And any of us who have ever taken it in the butt know that there is a whole lot of pain that you must deal with initially before you can enjoy the pleasurable aspects of butt sex! Bottoms are tough! I suspect that if there wasn’t the pain involved with it, that everyone would be a bottom or at least versatile.. who doesn’t want that ol’ prostate massaged by a heaping helping of man meat?

  20. Speaking as a self professed bottom, I feel that I am more proud of my identity than many tops who are only top because they can’t bear the idea of someone f*****g them, thereby stripping them of their “masculinity.” The irony is that I’m probably more in touch with my masculinity than they are. Oh, and when I’m bottoming, I’m more in charge than the top – they just think they are in charge. Without my ass, they’d be f*****g nothing.

  21. And finally someone speaks out…
    This is such coincidence, coz I just updated my status msg on one such gay dating site, saying that ‘bottoms probably have it the hardest’. They’re often the sweetest and are most often the best guys to hang out with, but most guys (me included) still prefer a more virile (assumed) top. What is it with pure stereotyped masculinity, that turns us on so much? Do you really think, it’s coz we lack it in us? I’m not too sure, but I do know that the next time I’m asked if I wanna top some guy, he’ll be shown the utmost respect for being so frank :)
    Bottoms rock and I guess we all need to get used to loving our men, whatever the position they may prefer :)

  22. I always wondered how you gays do the nasty. Thanks for the education.

  23. “All I know is love is love. In this world there ain’t enough. So y u wanna mess with us, when u know love is love. Beauty ain’t no difference, no matter y or who u’re with. So y u have 2 question it, don’t u know love is love. Open up ur eyes & u will c that love is blond… Cause if u’ve ever loved then u know that love’s sent down from above.” -RuPaul. Doesn’t that say it all?

  24. Oops, meant 2 type “love is blind”.

  25. Everything you said about yourself is totally true for me too, and a lot of other people I would think.
    And if you are in a relationship and start accusing people of cheating it is out of your insecurities as well, not justt that you might be doing it too.

  26. first Cliveey you’re a selfish pig. Secondly since this was posted I have been much more aware of the “masculinity” of the men in my town and have been very surprised to see, that they are not as manly as I thought. It has been very affirming. I have also noticed that I have been walking around with “gay goggles” on, and the mind set of how im for some reason supposed to be less of a man because I’m a f*g. what bull s**t, I love men doesn’t that make me double man? so then why did I create this whole situation within me? after realising that the whole top/bottom thing was no longer an issue.

    • … yeah we aim to please make that delight. Wanna be my sow? “It is your destiny Luke”. Love Darth. ( I will try to use the force gently).

    • I’d rather f**k a mound of razor blades covered in acid. It would appreciate it more, and be less diseased.

    • I won’t be jealous.You do have a wild imagination. Acid cannot harm acid amd you seem pretty sharp so I don’t suppose you will suffer much harm. We are clearly made for each other.

    • I feel that this has become a battle of wits. Never bet with a sicilian when death is on the line. You’ve fallen for one of the classic blunders. Quit now before make an even bigger fool of yourself.

  27. As soon as I read this I sent it to my boy friend who immediately said, “yeah but your not a bottom.” Looking him dead in the eye, I laughed. I am indeed a bottom, and fully enjoy being one. It’s amazing that even the people who know us best can sometimes adhere to certain mindsets. I’m not really the feminine type (though I think everyone has their moments), which makes most people assume I’m a top, when in reality… I suck at top (pun fully intended)! Sometimes I even do it, and I’m the bottom. I’m not exactly sure who it was that said it, but I was told that usually the guy who is dominant in public is submissive in bed. Not sure if that is the case for all, but at least in mine… it is.

    • The gay scene if full of bitch and little butch.
      People think all will be well if they get a straight guy to “come across”.
      The trouble is that they are usually looking for the opposite to waht they get from women.
      Many an old queen who has sparkled with delight when they pick up a sailor a “real man” from the docks – that queen is then crestfallen when they get them home, to find they roll over and say “f**k me”.
      It’s all in our head.

  28. Bottoming has it’s less obvious advantages. For example, it’s not your dick with the s**t on it!

    • …… wow that is the power of positive thinking,
      Equally it does not smell of fish.
      It doesn’t take much imagination or lack any spontaneity to get round those problems.
      **
      Its emotional problems not physical problems that need to be overcome.

  29. Oh the thought of Davey doing the mean and nasty with Tom Brady. I wish I were a better painter.

  30. very insightful
    thanks!

  31. I’m a proud bottom :) and I admit that I want a masculine man, but my gaydar needs tech support because I tend to “fall” for straight guys instead of masculine gay men. I can’t see myself being topped by a guy who’s fem..it just wouldn’t feel right, no matter how big his c**k is.

    • …. try what they call lateral thinking —- think sideways.
      If you stick to the same old formula in yur head you will
      get the same old results.
      I think you are young, which means you have time on your side.
      But if you just keep following the same trail you could end up
      following a lonely path.
      For life to be fun it is good to have someone to share it with.
      Looking to fulfil your dreams by getting occassional slip up
      fun from men who really want a woman (like when they have had a few))
      can lead to you being a sad lonely old man.
      We all have to accept some compromises in life.
      Find someone who can be a real companion and grow in love together.

  32. I didn’t know there was a stigma to being a bottom. It seems so strange to think less of someone who would allow you to top them. I would have assumed all tops loved their bottoms.

    I don’t even know how anyone could draw the conclusion that being a bottom makes you feminine.

    I’m not feminine, but I dislike it when gays talk down about being feminine. First, you’re gay. Second of all don’t you want the fact that you’re gay to be tolerated? Third, why the heck should anyone tolerate the fact that you’re gay when you can’t even tolerate someone who’s feminine. It’s just disgustingly hypocritical.

  33. Davey, loved your post. i for one really enjoy or LOVE being a bottom. i’m masculine, but in bed, i can’t help being fem when there is a guy with a throbbing c**k needing service !!! the idea of being sub just adds to my pleasure. thanks again, jay

  34. good article, Davey !! i happen to be a total bottom and i don’t care if i’m thought of as feminine or masculine but i do care about being the receiver of c***s !! lol best wishes.

  35. Great discussion to open! Illuminating comments! I’d say this blog is working!!

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